Wednesday, April 7, 2010
Defining and Responding to Turner’s Frontier
Let’s start class by reflecting on the excerpt from Frederick Jackson Turner’s essay that you read for today. One of the ways that Turner defines the frontier is this: “In this advance [of westward expansion], the frontier is the outer edge of the wave—the meeting point between savagery and civilization” (16). In your own words, explain what you think Turner means here. How does he define the frontier? How does this definition of the frontier relate to what it means to be an American? What group(s) of people does this definition celebrate? Who does it diminish or overlook? Ultimately, how does Turner’s discussion relate to your own understanding of the American West?
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Turner really dates himself in how he defines the frontier. By saying it is the boundary between civilization and savagery, he is implying that anything untouched by white men cannot possibly be civilized. In his section about Lewis and Clark, he seems to regard their notes on the Indian tribes to be nothing more than data to be lumped together with their botanical and geographical survey data.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, Turner's view of the frontier fits precisely with what it means to be an American. We fear and diminish that which we do not understand, and we expand to conquer people of a different skin color. Like it or not, that is what it means to be an American. Especially in the 1800s, our expansionist ideals were taken to the extreme, and to justify our conquest, we had to paint those on the other side of the frontier as savages.
Sadly enough, Turner's piece fits pretty well with my existing notions about the American west. I always imagined it as one of the darker parts of being american, up there with the internment camps in WW2, and Turner's piece plays exactly into that perception. We as americans are so blinded by our expansionism in the 1800s that we lose sight of our humanity.
In his quote, "In this advance [of westward expansion], the frontier is the outer edge of the wave--the meeting point between savagery and civilization"(16), Turner means that the frontier is the border between the land that the settlers already knew and the land that they had yet to discover. He defines the frontier as "the meeting point between savagery and civilization" (16). This meaning of frontier relates to what it means to be American in that it references westward expansion and civilization that made America the land and country that it is. It references the people who risked their lives and livelihoods and who came out west to make a better life for themselves and their families. The definition celebrates the pioneers and diminishes those who stayed east and the Native Americans. Turner's discussion relates to my own understanding of the American west in that it gave me a new, or a more congizant, perspective on the history of thought about the American west. It also helped me realize where a lot of my views of the West being a frontier came.
ReplyDeleteTurner is referring to the "outskirts" of civilization being the Frontier. He describes it as a place where man is first mastered by nature, man becomes less civilized on the frontier, it is a necessity that he put away his "European garments" and build log cabins, plant corn, and become less "civilized". He describes it as a place where once becomes less European and the more you go west, the more you become "American" by nature. The process of colonization in the west, its methods, the influence of various people are all "American" in roots, European no longer. The definition celebrates colonists, people like Lewis & Clark who explored the West, people who where "more American" than those who had settled in the "European"-based settlements. It somewhat diminishes European's as he says, "the new experiences [of the] ever retreating frontier has been to the United States directly, and to the nations of Europe more remotely." He insinuates that the Frontier is for Americans and benefits them more, so as such European's have little to do with the Frontier.
ReplyDeleteIt relates to my understanding as there are plenty of classic "Frontier" tales that are told to kids, like Paul Bunyan. The American Frontier was viewed as American in nature, no one has an image of the "wild west" in Europe, at heart it's an American tale.
By stating that the frontier is “the meeting point between savagery and civilization”, Frederick Jackson Turner attempts to explain the changes that were occurring on the frontier and to highlight the historical importance of those changes. According to Turner, much more of what it means to be an American can be found in the West compared to other Eastern states where the change is coming from. He finds the frontier important because it is a place where change is occurring at that very moment, and the “civilization” that is reaching the West reflects the ideals of American society. I feel like Turner’s discussion strongly relates to my feelings about the West because I feel that the West has a lot more history than it is sometimes attributed with having. Turner feels that “the true point of view in the history of this nation is not the Atlantic Coast, it is the great West,” and he supports this claim by stating that the West is important in giving America its own identity.
ReplyDeleteWhat I feel Turner was trying to say from this excerpt is the frontier as the outer edge of the wave is free from the civilization and ties of Europe, rather the people there live more like the “savages” of the west, and have begun to learn from them. They have move past the wave of European life into American life. He defines frontier as lying next to the free lands, rather then along the line of dense population. Not only does he include the settled lands of Americans, but also those lands of the Native Americans. This definition of frontier shows what the early settlers of the East did is the same as those of the West. In the East, they reacted on the styles of European cultures, and the Western settlers did the same with the Native Americans. Turner talks about stripping off “the garments of civilization” and dressing instead in a hunting shirt and moccasins, taking what the west has to offer and turning it into an American identity. This definition pays almost homage to Native Americans, while it also celebrates the western settlers who were able to interact in a positive fashion with the Native Americans of the area.
ReplyDeleteI think that the definition of Frontier by Turner outlines the idea that this movement symbolized so much more than just the gain of territory by the settlers who originally were of European descent. When one think of the “old” West, people think of pioneers, cowboys, native tribes such as the Apache, and these aspects of the western expansion can be considered savage due to their relative simplicity. Then the frontier traversed from a simple and arid landscape territory into the adoption of newer traditions and newer methods of settling land that was so different from previous colonists. Basically it tells that the frontier was the immersion into a newer culture different from the European descent colonists and settlers might have had when settling the west.
ReplyDeleteLiterally, he defines the frontier as the middle line separating the European-colonist into a new “group” (i.e. Americans). It relates to the concept of American patriotism because during this time, settlers became aware that they were separating themselves from their ancestral European heritage and making a new image for themselves. Anyone would consider being an American as having that identity that’s different yet unique and that freedom is what brings this uniqueness in this group of “people”.
This article celebrates the settlers and the various people who took change upon themselves to bring a new frontier in the America. Yet it overlooks the native tribes who were annihilated by the greed of most of the settlers that wanted nothing other than land and at some extent wealth in general. Turner makes a great point outlining the West as an important component of American identity and history in general. I certainly do not think he is entirely correct because this period of time also brought obscure moments in the American West that I know people shouldn’t celebrate or feel great inspiration towards. Genocide and deceit would be some of the major flaws that I dislike from this period of important history.
By saying that the frontier is where savagery and civilization meet, Turner means to say that people were fascinated by the West because it was beyond the end of what they knew and was therefore mysterious, or savage, to them. Turner defines the frontier as what defines America and sets it apart from Europe, it's the unknown and unconquered. This definition defines what it is to be American because it brings together numerous people of different backgrounds and fuses it into what we would define as American. This definition particularly celebrates the Scots-Irish, the Germans and the Dutch, as well as to some extent the English. This definition overlooks the Spanish, non-Europeans and Native Americans who inhabited the West before and who arrived at the same time or soon after white settlers. I agree that the West is a big concept that brought people together and eventually came to define America, but I feel that Turner's definition leaves out some important people. To me though, the West symbolizes the freedom and opportunity that these people were looking for and how these new lands became synonymous with that freedom.
ReplyDeleteI think that by this definition of frontier, Turner means to say that the frontier lies at the very beginning of the unknown. It is within reach of becoming part of the "civilized" people, but is not yet understood by them. He also brings out the point that the frontier is every changing and advancing just as a wave is. This relates to the meaning of being an American because as a society we are constantly growing, and as history has shown us, America has seen many rebirths and significant societal changes.
ReplyDeleteI believe this definition celebrates those people and groups who are willing to advance into the unknown in order to create change or aquire something new. This relates to my understanding of the American west because I believe the reasons people chose to explore the west was to gain something for themselves and communities.
The quote offered by Turner referencing the line between “savagery and civilization” is simply referring to the relentless spread of American influence throughout the west. The metaphoric line symbolizes a clash between foreign influence and pre-established native beliefs and values. Turner goes on to further elaborate on this idea of the frontier as “the line of most rapid and effective Americanization”. In essence, foreign cultural initiatives were being forcefully implemented in an overpowering wave of reform. However, Europeans were similarly influenced by the native inhabitants. The piece goes into great lengths regarding the effects of the pre-existing (native) culture and how it undoubtedly influenced their perceptions of the American west. This mutually influential effect of diverging cultures ultimately defines what it means to be American. It embodies a melting pot of ethical values and how we adopt various viewpoints as we are exposed to them. The frontier certainly foreshadowed the ways in which we would embrace differing cultures in they years to come.
ReplyDeleteTurner's essay regarding the American frontier describes it as a "meeting point between savagery and civilization" explaining that the Native American's "savage" ways were interrupted by the settlement of the whites that were claiming the "free land." The West was Americanized through a process of settlers coming together and descovering new ways of life and adopting new traditions, through which they were able to create a nation of composites and an American identity.
ReplyDeleteThe idea of a "melting pot" is generated in Turner's essay where the American frontier, free, vast plains, that are in a different ecosystem are occupied by different settlers who represent this ideal of what it means to be an American. By achieving and pursing Manifest Destiny, Americans were known as innovative, bouyant, progressive, and free of suppression.
The frontier is defined by Turner to be an explicit form of exploration and mystery. The frontier is where new settlement and journeying into the west has provided a start to civilization. During this time, the Native Americans were considered savages and brutal. When Turner talked about the meeting point between savagery and civilization, he meant how these Native Americans had civilization forced upon them. The history of America is written on this frontier since America has always been known as the “land of opportunity.” As the frontier has moved from Europe to the Atlantic coast, it has now then moved to America and moved away from the influence of Europe. An American is basically defined as someone who doesn’t walk before they leap. They are very ambitious, and are very willing to take risks. Because of these traits, Americans were able to explore the frontier of the western world. However valorous Turner made Americans look, the Indians were made out to be very savage and almost evil by western rhetoric. This idea of the western frontier provides a basic mindset into the ideals of the American West and how people thought during the time.
ReplyDeleteWhile reading this essay, one phrase kept popping up in my head: manifest destiny. Turner talks about westward expansion as what America was destined to do. Turner defines frontier as going from known to unknown and conquering that unknown. The essay tries to make it sound innocent and peaceful saying that pioneers would be civilized but also learn the ways of the Native Americans. I think the idea of a frontier has always been part of America’s history. First, there was the frontier of the thirteen colonies, then the frontier of westward expansion. As Americans, we have always been pioneers, looking for new innovations. The essay does overlook the aspect of Native Americans and their role in westward expansion. When he says that the frontier is between civilization and savagery, I feel as though he is talking about how we must civilize the west and Native Americans after learning some of their ways.
ReplyDeleteI think that when Turner says that the frontier is “the meeting point between savagery and civilization”, he is explaining the merging cultures of the early west. Traditionally, the Native Americans were thought of as savages because the way they related to one another and the land was very different from the way the settlers did. Rather than believing they owned the land, they felt that they lived and roamed on the land. In Turner’s mind, the expansion made people meet half way almost. The settlers had to learn from the natives about how to live on this new land and how to survive in a new environment. I think that Turner’s definition of the frontier is the idea that the “real American” is a rugged, strong individual who guides himself through a personal moral code and risks everything to make our country what it is. Unfortunately I think that his definition overlooks the fact that the land was not ours to take. There were people already living there and though their customs were different, they were not necessarily wrong. Though I am thankful I get to live in the west, I think this glorifies the settlers and does not pay enough attention to the suffering the expansion caused the natives.
ReplyDeleteAs I read Turner’s article, I can’t help but see connections between his definition of the frontier and the once popular notion of Manifest Destiny. In the 19th century, American citizens were told that it was their duty to move west and to settle savage western territory. They were told it was their destiny to bring the entire continent, from the Atlantic to the Pacific, into the American realm. Knowing this, I understand Turner’s definition of the frontier as the limit of this westward expansion or the extent to which Manifest Destiny has succeeded. It is the transition from western savagery to eastern civility. His definition venerates the American homesteader and honors the American pioneer. It values innovation, perseverance and the American work ethic. Turner’s definition of the frontier embodies American commonplaces and, in short, is a truly American definition. His perspective, however, overlooks the Native American viewpoint. He ignores the idea that in bringing civilization to the west, American homesteaders and pioneers encroached upon and repressed the indigenous Native American people – they conquered them. Reading Turner’s article, understanding the historical context and the biases with which it was written, I feel that it gives insight into what a nominal part of the American population believed at the time. Although it may not be historically accurate, I understand it to give a true and realistic glimpse of popular opinions and beliefs at the time.
ReplyDeleteBy defining frontier as “meeting point between savagery and civilization” Turner is saying that the frontier is where the work of the white man begins to diminish. It is the boundary line between the area the white man has already renovated and where they have yet to expand. This related to what it means to be an American because Americans see their lifestyle as the only acceptable one. We feel the need to Americanize everything. Therefore, Turner is saying that the frontier is the area that we will one day conquer and transform into what he views as a civilized lifestyle. This definition celebrates the early English settlers who took over the land. This definition diminishes the Native Americans. This relates to our personal understanding of the West because when we think of this subject we think of the Pocahontas story and how the settlers destroyed the lives of the Native Americans.
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